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 Where the nominees stand on gay rights

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gaboman

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PostSubject: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Tue Oct 07, 2008 2:19 am

Barack Obama
Joe Biden
John McCain
Sarah Palin


Barack and Joe seem like they're as pro-gay as possible, while still not pissing off their religious voters. Both are against don't ask, don't tell, are for gay and lesbian adoption and for anti-discrimination laws. Neither supports gay marriage (I have to say, I feel this is just a ploy to not turn devoute Christian voters off... I think supporting gay marriage would be the same as signing a death warrant for a presidential campaign... it's not right, it just is).

McCain is for don't ask, don't tell, and against gay and lesbian couples adopting children. Though McCain doesn't agree with gay marriage, he's also against any constitutional ammendment banning it. He voted AGAINST the local law enforcement hate crimes prevention act, however.

Palin is another kettle of fish. Her state banned gay marriage outright, and her church actively helps 'cure' homosexuality.

No thanks, man.

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Last edited by gaboman on Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:16 am; edited 1 time in total
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Lawless

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Tue Oct 07, 2008 2:59 am

Yeah.. while Palin is hot... she scares the crap outta me. Damn... is that woman for real? Someone needs to send her packing back to Alaska, and make her stay there. We don't need her...


As for all of our candidates... none of them are really FOR gay/lesbian rights. *sigh* Where's Hillary when you need her? Yes, I know that she wasn't for gay marriage, but, I liked her stance.

Personally, the government and the churches need to truly separate. I thought that Church and State were to be apart... but, they aren't. Are they? Just cancel "marriage" and make everyone get 'partners' and go from there. SHEESH! Really, what difference does it matter if I'm living with a woman, and having a relationship with her, like Adam and Eve might have... with or without a "marriage license" Is it hurting anyone? NO! It's not. We're still in relationships.

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Nymphadora

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Tue Oct 07, 2008 4:41 am

I don't know. ASccording to what Grant just put up it looks like Obama and Biden aren't exactly against gay rights. It looks like they are for a lot of them. And if I remember correctl Obama is for Civil Unions. I'm not sure how that all works but if civil unions give you the same rights as marriage then where is the problem? I agree, we are supposed to be a secular nation, but it doesn't happen that way. It sucks but eventually it'll get there.

I have several gay friends that have been in relationships for years and I mean 8, 10, 12 years and they say even if they could they wouldn't get "married" that they believe that marriage is between a man and I woman. So it goes both way really. I mean you not gonna have everyone for any demographic agree totally on things. You just gotta go with someone who remotly close and hope for the best.

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gaboman

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:20 am

Both Obama and Joe are for Civil Unions. Actually, there doesn't seem to be anything as far as gay rights goes that either Democrat nominee is against. They stop short of gay marriage, but like you said even Hillary wasn't for it. They can't be, not officially. Once you say you're for gay marriage, your campaign is over. Just as if they were to say "boo for guns!"

Government and churches do need to be separate, but unfortuantely it seems a lot of Americans take their religion so seriously that the candidate's stance on issues will be more or less decided by their religious ideology.

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Nymphadora

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Tue Oct 07, 2008 5:47 am

The whole religion in goverment thing is just something I don't understand. I mean we are a nation that is founded by a quest for freedom of religion. You are supposed to be able to practice what you believe free of presecution, but apparently there is a clause in there that I missed and it seems to read something along the lines of as long as it's Christianity.

Seriously, I couldn't tell you how many people I've had conversations with that throw up stuff about this being America and I'll use Obama as an example. I've heard several people say they won't vote for him because he's muslim, wich is bullshit. But They say it's America and he should practice the religion Americans practice. I tell them, yeah it's American, we are supposed to have freedom of religion and there is supposed to be seperation of church and state. They never give an good retort to that, they just look at me like I'm some sort of alien life form.

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Dekka00

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Tue Oct 07, 2008 6:24 am

the thing that pisses me off about people not voting for Obama cuz he's muslim is that's HE'S NOT EVEN A FRIGGIN MUSLIM.
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Lawless

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:23 am

Buffy... you're right. It's just, until you're told that you don't have the right to marry who you love, it's hard to explain. To be told that you don't have equal rights. I know that Obama and Biden are at least for us having tax rights, and hospital visitations. But, the fact is, most states require you to go and pay MASSIVE fees, to have legal documentation drawn up, just to give you the right to even VISIT your patner/lover (whatever the states want to call it) in the hospital. Then, you have the hospital staff who fight it, and still don't want to let you in.. because you aren't "Family." Give me a f'n break... we're just as much family.

It's really sad.... the level of intolerance, in this world. I'm sick of it, personally. And if I could just move to a place (another country) that saw people as equals, across the board... I would. There should be no difference between people. We are all human beings. It doesn't matter race, sex, religion, sexuality, etc... We are all one people.

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Nymphadora

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:09 am

Dekka00 wrote:
the thing that pisses me off about people not voting for Obama cuz he's muslim is that's HE'S NOT EVEN A FRIGGIN MUSLIM.

Exactly...but they read it in an email...it must be true.

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Nymphadora

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:16 am

Lawless wrote:
Buffy... you're right. It's just, until you're told that you don't have the right to marry who you love, it's hard to explain. To be told that you don't have equal rights. I know that Obama and Biden are at least for us having tax rights, and hospital visitations. But, the fact is, most states require you to go and pay MASSIVE fees, to have legal documentation drawn up, just to give you the right to even VISIT your patner/lover (whatever the states want to call it) in the hospital. Then, you have the hospital staff who fight it, and still don't want to let you in.. because you aren't "Family." Give me a f'n break... we're just as much family.

It's really sad.... the level of intolerance, in this world. I'm sick of it, personally. And if I could just move to a place (another country) that saw people as equals, across the board... I would. There should be no difference between people. We are all human beings. It doesn't matter race, sex, religion, sexuality, etc... We are all one people.

I understand what your saying and I couldn't even possbily being to understand how it feels though. On some levels I can relate though. It sucks but it's slowly getting better. Your always going to have people who are asses. And until we as a nation don't let religion influence law than there are going to be obsticles. BUt you've got to fight for your rights. Take womens right for example. Most of the women who fought for the rights we have today never got to benefit from them, but they made a change. And that's about all you can hope to do. Things have come a long way but they still have a ways to go. The things we do now aren't for our generation, it's to make this a better nation for the next generation. It's going to take a lot of work to turn things around from how they are now but it can be do. It sucks it has to be that why, but that's America for ya.

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Lawless

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:26 pm

You're right, Buffy. The changes are slow... and we have come a very long way already. It's just awesome to be a part of the process... to get to fight. And I think that you're right about the women's right movement. I bet that they felt the same way. Frustrated... but proud to be a part of the process, and to know that they were fighting to make a difference for the future women of America.

What pisses me off is that the RIGHT WINGERS are putting out ad's, saying that if Prop 8 (same-sex marriage) doesn't pass on Nov 4th, that they will have to start teaching this in schools. That churches will lose their tax rights, etc... They are dishing LIES to get the right wing to vote.

I have a cousin, who is so far right, I think that he falls off the scale. He has NEVER voted before, in his life. Never cared. But, he went and registered, and is voting, this year, only to stop same-sex marriages from staying legal here in California. This is the asshole who told my mom that SHE is going to hell, because her child is gay, and she loves me as I am. BASTARD!!!

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Nymphadora

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PostSubject: Re: Where the nominees stand on gay rights   Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:48 pm

Oh, man, he sounds like a total douche.

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